Refund4Freedom campaign pushes Windows license refunds from PC makers
A new initiative helps consumers demand reimbursement for unwanted Windows licenses bundled into laptops.
What to know
- Refund4Freedom provides step-by-step instructions for consumers to request Windows license refunds from PC manufacturers, with mixed success rates across vendors.
- Manufacturers vary widely: Asus offers refunds without shipping requirements, Lenovo has a refund procedure but requires service center shipment, and HP ignores refund requests.
- The campaign's core argument—that general-purpose devices should let consumers choose software without forced payment—faces pushback from those who argue buying systems without Windows is already an option.
The dispute Whether requesting Windows refunds from existing systems is a practical consumer rights strategy or whether buyers should simply select Linux-capable models at purchase time instead. · positions read across 28 posts and comments
Refund campaigns are worthwhile; manufacturers should offer transparent, hassle-free refund processes.
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“This is great. It tells you how many manufacturers make it easy and difficult to get refunds.”
vkaku · Hacker News
Buying systems without Windows preinstalled is already available and a better solution than demanding refunds.
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“Since one can get a lot of models with and without Windows, I would suggest to ask the seller to get a variant without windows.”
flaep · Hacker News
Forcing hardware vendors to unbundle operating systems is unreasonable; devices need software to function.
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“Hardware needs software to work, and software runs on an operating system. You can't expect every vendor in the work of every kind of product you can buy to offer you a slightly different version than you would like to buy.”
gwbas1c · Hacker News
“You should not have to pay for software you don't want. Devices like laptops and smartphones are general purpose computers so, they should be neutral in relation to the software they run.”
Refund4Freedom · refund4freedom.org
Refund4Freedom Consumer advocacy campaignHP PC manufacturerLenovo PC manufacturerAsus PC manufacturer
The record 1 articles and posts · last 30 days
What people are saying 24 voices from 1 site · best of 28 · verbatim
- Is the Refund4Freedom campaign limited to Italy or available internationally?
- Why aren't Apple and mobile device makers subject to the same refund expectations?
- Aug 29
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"Consumers should be able to buy laptops without any specific operating system, and should not have to pay the license price if they don't want to."How to make sales when generally no one wants to buy what you are selling, e.g., a proprietary software licenseTie the product to another product that generally everyone wants to buy, e.g., personal…
- Aug 28
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One of the reasons I like building my own PC is that when I build it from parts, I don't have to pay then windows tax when I'm just putting linux on it.Although that doesn't work as well for laptops :( .
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Better yet, take your business directly to System 76, Star Labs, Framework, or other FOSS/H-friendly vendors, that give you choices:
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Sometimes, it seems, Microsoft will actually OEM Windows at a loss. A year ago I bought some NUCs with Windows pre-installed that were less expensive that if they came with Ubuntu. Microsoft apparently felt is was important to try and hang onto that market. I bought the less expensive NUCs with Windows and then formatted them and installed Ubuntu…
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So your personal computer was not tied to a specific OS and you were easily about to get a refund for the license cost of the OS that shipped in box. So what’s the issue? Do you want hardware to ship without any software?
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I also raised an eyebrow at "the vast majority of laptops are only sold with a specific proprietary operating system: Microsoft Windows", but after looking at some estimates it seems legit. Probably only about 1 in 10 laptops is a Mac. Software developers really just live in a different world than normal people.It got me thinking though: what is a…
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> Consumers should have the right to decline pre-installed softwareAs a consumer I should also have the right to free ice cream and a pony ride.Many of us have tried to start or run businesses small or large. Does it make any sense for a government to start telling us what software the business should use or not use?Consumers already have the…
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The real culprit is Microsoft's licensing which gives PC manufacturers a "discount" when they install Windows on all their computers. As soon as they deliver machines without it they lose the discount on all the Windows machines they sell.This should be challenged in court and prohibited by law. But so far, no computer manufacturer has dared to do…
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I was part of an event called "Windows Refund Day" in 1999 (I think) to draw attention to this issue. We had a march to a Microsoft office to ask for refunds (unsuccessfully). It was fun, but it's 27 years later and it's still a problem.Edit: it's covered on Wikipedia at
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Just getting your money back doesn't make it work well with other operating systems.Instead, buy hardware from vendors that ship hardware with the operating system you want to use preinstalled, and with support you can contact to get help if something breaks.
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Is the money refunded related to the cost of the OS license? Why not just advocate that manufacturers and vendors don't pass the cost off to consumers?
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> Which was extra nice because I had no idea I was in fact charged for the bloatware, but I still got ~50€ for it on top of the OS license price.I actually expected those to pay for being pre-installed, offsetting or possibly even exceeding the cost of the Windows license.
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I havent used Windows in years so maybe somethings changed, and far be it from me to get in the way of someone taking them down a peg, but this bit confused me:> The vendors do not remove the Windows license, and you must pay the entire price, even if you do not want to use this system.Surely if you don't want Windows you just boot from a usb…
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I switched two of my PCs over to Linux Mint last week. The automatic driver support is shockingly good compared to when I last installed Linux on a PC (almost 20 years ago). It even found a driver for the random no-name USB wireless receiver I bought on Amazon, whereas I had to install that driver manually on Windows.Part of my motivation was that…
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I have a sneaking suspicion that Dell probably had standing orders to not bother to argue with someone who wanted a reimbursement for Windows, and just get it over with. If you care enough to want that, you care enough to argue your case and make life a hassle for everyone if Dell refuses. To even ask the question is a shibboleth that instantly…
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I am seriously saddened by the complete takeover of mobile computing by Apple and Google. There is no freedom on your own device to choose your own software, except inside the very narrow constraints allowed.
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You can always get your money back with Linux and any of the BSDs. The claim will have been accepted and processed before you've even filed it!
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I would rather get full refound for laptop, if I disagree with the license. Windows is unseparatable from hardware after all...Use laptop for a few months, than finally boot windows install...
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Seems like it makes a lot more sense to buy a computer without Windows preinstalled.> Device manufacturers and vendors should not impose an operating system or software on consumersThis is not a reasonable expectation.Hardware needs software to work, and software runs on an operating system. You can't expect every vendor in the work of every kind…
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In 2011 I got a 143€ reimbursement from Dell for an E6420 laptop that I had bought for 910€.Maybe I got lucky but I called the customer service, told the lady I did not agree with the Windows license terms, fully ready to argue my case and she just went "oh, ok, let me just edit a new invoice and wire you the money for Windows plus the Antivirus…
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Looks like this is Italy-only.I’m pretty sure (though I have no record of it) that I asked ASUS Australia through their online channels before I bought my current laptop six years ago, and they said no. I never tried following it up more closely. In truth at that stage I didn’t mind having a Windows license, it was convenient for testing certain…
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I think some manufacturers offer the ability to buy hardware without software preinstalled and have the software as add-ons you can opt-in. That should be the way.
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Since one can get a lot of models with and without Windows, I would suggest to ask the seller to get a variant without windows. This way availability sorts it self over time. Vendors do not want to sell Windows Notebooks, seller just demand only windows notebooks. OEM/ODM will however only test some linux distributions and very likely support none.
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This is great. It tells you how many manufacturers make it easy and difficult to get refunds. ASUS is the most specific one, albeit their refund range is between 9 and 65 EUR. Great work.