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TechActive · 35h

Apple's macOS UI loses its design edge as Liquid Glass looms

Native Mac interface design has degraded from Aqua's pixel-perfect standard into inconsistent Catalyst ports and web-like apps, prompting debate over custom UIs.

What to know

  • macOS native UI design has deteriorated from the distinctive, pixel-perfect Aqua standard into inconsistent Catalyst ports and iOS-influenced apps that feel interchangeable with web views.
  • The decay stems from Apple's shift toward cross-platform iOS-derivative interfaces rather than platform-specific design, undermining the company's historical UI leadership.
  • Developers are split on whether custom UI frameworks (like Liquid Glass) are a necessary correction or a further fragmentation, and whether consistency with web standards should override platform distinctiveness.
  • Nostalgia for pre-Catalyst Mac UI—particularly System 7 and Mac OS 9—reflects frustration that Apple abandoned its own interface design principles.

The dispute Whether distinctive native UI design that isolates a platform from web standards (and other systems) is a value worth preserving, or whether cross-platform consistency and user familiarity should take priority. · positions read across 23 posts and comments

most voices

Apple's shift to Catalyst and iOS-derived interfaces destroyed native UI coherence; the company abandoned its own design principles.

  • “I think Apple lost all of their native UI advantage (it's not that anyone else beat them, they're all a mess now).”

    kornel · Lobsters ↗
some voices

Consistency with web standards and existing user training matters more than platform-distinctive custom UI that isolates users.

  • “I place no value (actually, a slight negative value) on the ability to do things in the UI that are so fancy that no other system can easily emulate them.”

    mcherm · Lobsters ↗
some voices

Older Mac OS versions (System 7, Mac OS 9) offered superior usability and aesthetic experience despite technical limitations; a faithful revival would be preferable.

  • “I was doing nerd work in CodeWarrior this weekend on Mac OS 9.2.2 and it felt like a pleasure, even if the operating system underpinnings are best not looked at over a meal.”

    classichasclass · Lobsters ↗

Brent Simmons Developer, Inessential authorApple Platform vendor

How it unfolded 4 developments, newest first · click a bar or a number to jump postscomments

Peak 3 pieces in one half hour at Yesterday, 1 PM; 26 pieces over 36 hours (5 posts · 21 comments) Sep 22, 2:09 PM — quietSep 22, 2:39 PM — 1 piece · 1 post — Hacker News 1Sep 22, 3:09 PM — 1 piece · 1 post — Lobsters 1Sep 22, 3:39 PM — quietSep 22, 4:09 PM — quietSep 22, 4:39 PM — quietSep 22, 5:09 PM — 1 piece · 1 comment — Lobsters 1Sep 22, 5:39 PM — quietSep 22, 6:09 PM — quietSep 22, 6:39 PM — quietSep 22, 7:09 PM — quietSep 22, 7:39 PM — quietSep 22, 8:09 PM — quietSep 22, 8:39 PM — 2 pieces · 2 comments — Lobsters 2Sep 22, 9:09 PM — quietSep 22, 9:39 PM — quietSep 22, 10:09 PM — quietSep 22, 10:39 PM — 2 pieces · 2 comments — Lobsters 2Sep 22, 11:09 PM — 1 piece · 1 comment — Lobsters 1Sep 22, 11:39 PM — 1 piece · 1 comment — Lobsters 1Yesterday, 12:09 AM — quietYesterday, 12:39 AM — quietYesterday, 1:09 AM — quietYesterday, 1:39 AM — quietYesterday, 2:09 AM — 1 piece · 1 comment — Lobsters 1Yesterday, 2:39 AM — quietYesterday, 3:09 AM — quietYesterday, 3:39 AM — quietYesterday, 4:09 AM — quietYesterday, 4:39 AM — 1 piece · 1 comment — Lobsters 1Yesterday, 5:09 AM — quietYesterday, 5:39 AM — quietYesterday, 6:09 AM — 1 piece · 1 comment — Lobsters 1Yesterday, 6:39 AM — 2 pieces · 2 comments — Lobsters 2Yesterday, 7:09 AM — 1 piece · 1 post — Mastodon 1Yesterday, 7:39 AM — quietYesterday, 8:09 AM — quietYesterday, 8:39 AM — quietYesterday, 9:09 AM — 2 pieces · 2 comments — Lobsters 2Yesterday, 9:39 AM — quietYesterday, 10:09 AM — quietYesterday, 10:39 AM — quietYesterday, 11:09 AM — quietYesterday, 11:39 AM — quietYesterday, 12:09 PM — 1 piece · 1 comment — Lobsters 1Yesterday, 12:39 PM — 1 piece · 1 comment — Lobsters 1Yesterday, 1:09 PM — quietYesterday, 1:39 PM — 3 pieces · 3 comments — Lobsters 3Yesterday, 2:09 PM — quietYesterday, 2:39 PM — quietYesterday, 3:09 PM — quietYesterday, 3:39 PM — quietYesterday, 4:09 PM — quietYesterday, 4:39 PM — quietYesterday, 5:09 PM — quietYesterday, 5:39 PM — 1 piece · 1 comment — Lobsters 1Yesterday, 6:09 PM — 1 piece · 1 comment — Lobsters 1Yesterday, 6:39 PM — 1 piece · 1 post — Hacker News 1Yesterday, 7:09 PM — quietYesterday, 7:39 PM — quietYesterday, 8:09 PM — quietYesterday, 8:39 PM — quietYesterday, 9:09 PM — 1 piece · 1 post — Mastodon 1Yesterday, 9:39 PM — quietYesterday, 10:09 PM — quietYesterday, 10:39 PM — quietYesterday, 11:09 PM — quietYesterday, 11:39 PM — quietToday, 12:09 AM — quietToday, 12:39 AM — quietToday, 1:09 AM — quietToday, 1:39 AM — quiet 12–4
4 PMyesterday8 AM4 PMnow · 2:09 AM ET
  1. 4

    Commenters divide on whether consistency or distinctiveness matters more

    Discussion emerges over whether macOS should prioritize consistency with web and existing user training over platform-distinctive custom UI. One commenter prioritizes consistency and web familiarity; others express nostalgia for System 7 and old-Mac aesthetics that stand apart from web norms.

    “I place no value (actually, a slight negative value) on the ability to do things in the UI that are so fancy that no other system can easily emulate them.”
    — mcherm
    • Apple is in a weird place. They clearly wanted the Mac to die around 2017. They were doing everything they could to effectively sabotage the platform, from letting hardware just sit on the market for too long, not fixing the broken keyboard for years, stripping off all the ports for the Mac. The only stuff coming to MacOS were basically ports of…

      maduggandesign,mac19h ago13▲view on Lobsters ↗
    2 more of the top 3 · 18 posts in this stretch
    • nmott@infosec.exchange

      interesting take on native versus non-native user interfaces on macOS: https:// inessential.com/2026/09/22/tha t-about-wraps-it-up-for.html the obvious response is that it’s funny to have to ask if people care if software they’re using looks and behaves the same as other software they’re using. they don’t. of course they don’t. they use computer…

      nmott@infosec.exchangeMastodon18h agoview on Mastodon ↗
    • I think that was largely a coincidence. There were also a lot of ex-NeXT and ex-early-Apple people who really understood design that reached retirement age in the last 10-15 years. If you were 30 when NeXT was founded, you'd be 65 in 2020. My impression was that Apple wasn't good at explaining to new hires *why* things were the way that they were…

      david_chisnalldesign,mac16h ago12▲view on Lobsters ↗
    all of them →
  2. 3

    Critics cite Apple's historical design leadership before degradation

    Commenters invoke Apple's past authorship of human interface design principles, suggesting the company has abandoned its own standards rather than being surpassed by competitors.

    “Quite astonishing, considering that Apple (quite literally) wrote the book on human interface design*. They didn't necessarily kill the golden goose, but they certainly poisoned it and let it die alone in the corner.”
    — DragonMaus
    • Quite astonishing, considering that Apple (quite literally) wrote the book on human interface design*. They didn't necessarily kill the golden goose, but they certainly poisoned it and let it die alone in the corner. *Well, Jobs and his crew of best-in-the-industry NeXT engineers did, after Apple begged him to return after they canned him.

      DragonMausdesign,mac1d ago8▲view on Lobsters ↗
  3. 2

    Developers argue Apple's design consistency has collapsed

    Commenters on Lobsters characterize Apple's UI direction as having lost native advantages, with one noting that Catalyst and "half-assed iOSification" made "native macOS UI" unrecognizable—apps like Home and Music now feel arbitrary rather than distinctly Mac.

    “I think Apple lost all of their native UI advantage (it's not that anyone else beat them, they're all a mess now).”
    — kornel
    • I think Apple lost all of their native UI advantage (it's not that anyone else beat them, they're all a mess now). Lucida-Grande-era Aqua was unique and its pixel-perfect widgets were impossible to fake. But Catalyst and half-assed iOSification introduced so much inconsistency that "native macOS UI" stopped being a recognizable thing. If the…

      korneldesign,mac1d ago34▲view on Lobsters ↗
    2 more of the top 3 · 3 posts in this stretch
    • Currently I think the biggest UI annoyance with macOS is the rounded content window corners, which was a thing even pre-Tahoe. It even cuts off corners of images. Who thought that was a good idea? Meanwhile, I was doing nerd work in CodeWarrior this weekend on Mac OS 9.2.2 and it felt like a pleasure, even if the operating system underpinnings are…

      classichasclassdesign,mac1d ago10▲view on Lobsters ↗
    • Codewarrior was so nice to use. I'm sure the passage of time has caused me to forget some papercuts from those days. Given some of the other disagreements I have with the direction of the OS and the iDevices, if there were a really good Mac OS 9 theme for Plasma, I might switch back to Linux and just leave the Mac for when I actually need to build…

      hoistbypetarddesign,mac1d ago4▲view on Lobsters ↗
    all of them →
  4. 1

    Brent Simmons publishes essay on decline of macOS native UI design

    Developer Brent Simmons posts "That About Wraps It Up for Stock Mac UI" on Inessential, examining how Apple's native interface design has degraded from the Lucida Grande Aqua era through Catalyst and iOS-influenced ports that introduced inconsistency into the platform.

    • Hitchhiker's Guide reference? (So, the stock Mac UI is "God"?)

      dtgriscomdesign,mac1d ago2▲view on Lobsters ↗

What people are saying 15 voices from 2 sites · best of 23 · verbatim

Still unanswered
  • What is Liquid Glass and how does it relate to this UI decline being discussed?
  • Are major macOS apps like Home and Music actually Catalyst ports or web views, or is that characterization oversimplified?