conv.

All stories
BusinessQuiet 11d · day 18

Apollo economist Slok: AI has delivered 'zero financial payoff' outside tech

A viral Apollo research note finds revenue and productivity gains from AI confined almost entirely to the Magnificent Seven, stoking investor anxiety ahead of Big Tech earnings.

Part of a larger narrative

The AI Chip Bubble

12 stories · since Oct 14 · newest 4d ago — A sharp reversal in investor enthusiasm for AI semiconductor companies is triggering a cascade of postponed offerings, executive warnings about speculative…

  1. OpenAI cuts funding round target to $20B as valuation drops to $1.25T
  2. S&P cuts Meta outlook to negative over $252B AI capex and cash flow deficits
  3. OpenAI launches election 'war room' ahead of US midterms
  4. OpenAI Reportedly Plans to Buy Google's TPUs, Diversifying From Nvidia
  5. Oracle moves to raise $20 billion in stock and bonds to fund AI buildout
All 12 stories in this narrative →

What to know

  • Apollo's Torsten Slok finds revenue per worker and profit margins rising only for the 'Mag 7,' flat for the other 493 S&P companies, with no evidence of AI-driven productivity growth
  • Mainstream corporate America is reportedly starting to treat AI 'token spending' as a cost center rather than a growth driver, per the report
  • The finding lands days before Alphabet, Amazon and Microsoft earnings, amid fears a repeat of the market's harsh reaction to Meta's capex plans could hit the sector again
  • Online reaction splits between those citing it as proof AI hype is overblown and those arguing payoff is simply too early or undermined by poor corporate implementation, not the technology itself

The dispute Whether the absence of measurable AI payoff outside tech is evidence the technology itself is overhyped, or simply reflects poor corporate execution and insufficient time for returns to materialize. · positions read across 112 posts and comments

most voices

The data confirms the promised AI productivity boom outside tech is not happening and spending is wasted.

  • “Remember that AI productivity boom they were all promising?? Well, according to Apollo, there are NO signs of this through the broader economy. The only sector that benefits is tech.”

    @puckrin · X ↗
some voices

The lack of payoff reflects bad management and implementation inside companies, not a failure of AI itself.

  • “I have worked in multiple companies where the internally developed software was central to the business success, yet it was handled in an extremely bad way... The management did constantly override technical decisions and/or switched the…”

    Fanmade · Hacker News ↗
some voices

It's too early to expect a measurable financial payoff from AI adoption.

  • “I don't see why a payoff would have appeared yet. Many (but certainly not all) software companies have increased their output without hiring more people. But having software with more features doesn't necessarily drive immediate…”

    ttul · Hacker News ↗

Torsten Slok Apollo Chief EconomistApollo Asset management firmAlphabet, Amazon, Microsoft Big Tech companies reporting earningsMeta Big Tech company, prior earnings reference point

Apollo economist Slok: AI has delivered 'zero financial payoff' outside tech
x.com

How it unfolded 6 developments, newest first · click a bar or a number to jump articlesvideospostscomments

Peak 51 pieces in 4h at Oct 24, 3 PM; 192 pieces over 18 days (45 articles · 1 video · 69 posts · 77 comments) Oct 21, 7 AM — 1 piece · 1 post — Hacker News 1Oct 21, 11 AM — quietOct 21, 3 PM — 1 piece · 1 article — Google News 1Oct 21, 7 PM — quietOct 21, 11 PM — quietOct 22, 3 AM — 1 piece · 1 article — Newswires 1Oct 22, 7 AM — quietOct 22, 11 AM — quietOct 22, 3 PM — 2 pieces · 1 article · 1 video — Newswires 1, YouTube 1Oct 22, 7 PM — quietOct 22, 11 PM — quietOct 23, 3 AM — quietOct 23, 7 AM — 1 piece · 1 article — Google News 1Oct 23, 11 AM — 1 piece · 1 article — Google News 1Oct 23, 3 PM — 2 pieces · 2 articles — Google News 2Oct 23, 7 PM — quietOct 23, 11 PM — quietOct 24, 3 AM — quietOct 24, 7 AM — quietOct 24, 11 AM — quietOct 24, 3 PM — 51 pieces · 15 articles · 9 posts · 27 comments — Hacker News 23, Newswires 12, Reddit 7, +3 moreOct 24, 7 PM — 18 pieces · 4 posts · 14 comments — Hacker News 9, Reddit 6, Mastodon 3Oct 24, 11 PM — 8 pieces · 2 posts · 6 comments — Hacker News 6, X 1, Mastodon 1Oct 25, 3 AM — 14 pieces · 4 articles · 4 posts · 6 comments — Reddit 4, Google News 3, Mastodon 3, +3 moreOct 25, 7 AM — 12 pieces · 1 article · 9 posts · 2 comments — Mastodon 6, Hacker News 3, Bluesky 1, +2 moreOct 25, 11 AM — 18 pieces · 7 articles · 8 posts · 3 comments — Mastodon 6, Newswires 5, Hacker News 2, +3 moreOct 25, 3 PM — 13 pieces · 4 articles · 7 posts · 2 comments — Bluesky 4, Newswires 3, Mastodon 2, +3 moreOct 25, 7 PM — 11 pieces · 3 posts · 8 comments — Hacker News 8, Mastodon 2, Bluesky 1Oct 25, 11 PM — 2 pieces · 1 post · 1 comment — Hacker News 1, Mastodon 1Oct 26, 3 AM — 12 pieces · 3 articles · 6 posts · 3 comments — Bluesky 4, Newswires 3, Hacker News 2, +2 moreOct 26, 7 AM — 11 pieces · 8 posts · 3 comments — Mastodon 5, Hacker News 3, Bluesky 2, +1 moreOct 26, 11 AM — 3 pieces · 2 articles · 1 post — Google News 2, Bluesky 1Oct 26, 3 PM — quietOct 26, 7 PM — 1 piece · 1 post — Bluesky 1Oct 26, 11 PM — quietOct 27, 3 AM — 4 pieces · 2 articles · 1 post · 1 comment — Newswires 2, Mastodon 1, Reddit 1Oct 27, 7 AM — 2 pieces · 2 posts — Bluesky 2Oct 27, 11 AM — 1 piece · 1 post — Bluesky 1Oct 27, 3 PM — quietOct 27, 7 PM — 1 piece · 1 comment — Reddit 1Oct 27, 11 PM — quietOct 28, 3 AM — 1 piece · 1 post — Bluesky 1Oct 28, 7 AM — quietOct 28, 11 AM — quietOct 28, 3 PM — quietOct 28, 7 PM — quietOct 28, 11 PM — quietOct 29, 3 AM — quietOct 29, 7 AM — quietOct 29, 11 AM — quietOct 29, 3 PM — quietOct 29, 7 PM — quietOct 29, 11 PM — quietOct 30, 3 AM — quietOct 30, 7 AM — quietOct 30, 11 AM — quietOct 30, 3 PM — quietOct 30, 7 PM — quietOct 30, 11 PM — quietOct 31, 3 AM — quietOct 31, 7 AM — quietOct 31, 11 AM — quietOct 31, 3 PM — quietOct 31, 7 PM — quietOct 31, 11 PM — quietNov 1, 2 AM — quietNov 1, 6 AM — quietNov 1, 10 AM — quietNov 1, 2 PM — quietNov 1, 6 PM — quietNov 1, 10 PM — quietNov 2, 2 AM — quietNov 2, 6 AM — quietNov 2, 10 AM — quietNov 2, 2 PM — quietNov 2, 6 PM — quietNov 2, 10 PM — quietNov 3, 2 AM — quietNov 3, 6 AM — quietNov 3, 10 AM — quietNov 3, 2 PM — quietNov 3, 6 PM — quietNov 3, 10 PM — quietNov 4, 2 AM — quietNov 4, 6 AM — quietNov 4, 10 AM — quietNov 4, 2 PM — quietNov 4, 6 PM — quietNov 4, 10 PM — quietNov 5, 2 AM — quietNov 5, 6 AM — quietNov 5, 10 AM — quietNov 5, 2 PM — quietNov 5, 6 PM — quietNov 5, 10 PM — quietNov 6, 2 AM — quietNov 6, 6 AM — quietNov 6, 10 AM — quietNov 6, 2 PM — quietNov 6, 6 PM — quietNov 6, 10 PM — quietYesterday, 2 AM — quietYesterday, 6 AM — quietYesterday, 10 AM — quietYesterday, 2 PM — quietYesterday, 6 PM — quietYesterday, 10 PM — quietToday, 2 AM — quietToday, 6 AM — quietToday, 10 AM — quiet 123456
Oct 23Oct 25Oct 27Oct 29Oct 31Nov 2Nov 4now · 1:09 PM ET
  1. 6

    Bloomberg ties Apollo findings to looming Big Tech earnings risk

    Bloomberg reporting connected the Apollo analysis to this week's earnings from Alphabet, Amazon and Microsoft, noting investors are growing impatient with AI capex and that markets may punish any disappointment as harshly as they did Meta's spending plans.

    “Private Equity firm Apollo sees no point in "AI" in all but big tech companies.”
    — redwolf.ws, Bluesky user · source
    1. first by Channel News Asia, 12d ago

    2. first by Bloomberg, 13d ago

    • progressivebeat.bsky.social

      "Anthropic has focused on businesses as its primary paying customers, unlike OpenAI, which has courted everyday consumers for ChatGPT." "AI delivers ‘zero financial payoff’ to most companies, Apollo economist says"

      progressivebeat.bsky.socialBluesky13d ago3▲view on Bluesky ↗
    2 more of the top 3 · 25 posts in this stretch
    • Ok, now you're bringing data so I (also a rando commenter) will take you seriously. I think you've used a bot for it but as long as it's correct that's cool. I already agreed with you that the tech giants will survive with or without AI. And I don't care about their survival. I've never thought they'd die but I wouldn't care if they did, because…

      Interesting-Baar/technology11d agoview on r/technology ↗
    • Not really. Like, yes, relative to your competitors. But, if the cost of growing potatoes is ten cents per potato, and then I make something that can produce potatoes for one cent then I'd expect everyone to just have more potatoes. This would drive down the cost of potatoes, because the supply would be saturated eventually, but AI is supposed to…

      d0liverHacker News13d agoview on Hacker News ↗
    all of them →
  2. 5

    Press widely reports Slok's findings

    TechCrunch, Bloomberg, Business Insider and Semafor published stories on the Apollo analysis, intensifying investor focus on AI spending just ahead of Big Tech earnings.

    “Mainstream corporate America is pulling back and starting to view token spending not as a source of growth but as a cost center that weighs on margins.”
    — Torsten Slok
    • carlquintanilla.bsky.social

      SLOK: “.. Revenue per worker is rising for the Mag 7 but is flat for the S&P 493. .. Mainstream corporate America is pulling back and starting to view token spending not as a source of growth but as a cost center that weighs on margins.” @bloomberg.com

      carlquintanilla.bsky.socialBluesky14d ago981▲view on Bluesky ↗
    2 more of the top 3 · 25 posts in this stretch
    • pluralistic@mamot.fr

      This analyst's report from Apollo about AI uses the term "S&P 493" to refer to the "S&P 500 minus the Mag 7" - because if you take out the AI companies, the S&P 500 is tanking. https://www. apollo.com/wealth/insights-new s/insights/daily-spark/no-signs-of-ai-payoff-outside-the-tech-sector

      pluralistic@mamot.frMastodon14d ago64▲view on Mastodon ↗
    • The economy has many different resources with different supplies available. Making the supply of one resource infinite may sound like a huge win, but nothing is dependent on a single resource, everything requires a combination – just like in board game economies, you can't win by only producing wood.AI represents some weird intelligence-like…

      danpalmerHacker News13d agoview on Hacker News ↗
    all of them →
  3. 4

    Social media amplifies Slok's 'zero payoff' finding

    Finance-focused accounts on X and Bluesky spread the Apollo finding rapidly, framing it as evidence the promised AI productivity boom has not materialized beyond the tech sector.

    “493 out of 500 companies in the S&P 500 saw no benefit from adopting AI...”
    — @puckrin
    • APOLLO: AI HAS DELIVERED “ZERO PAYOFF” OUTSIDE BIG TECH Apollo Chief Economist Torsten Slok warns that massive AI spending has yet to deliver measurable productivity gains across corporate America. Revenue per worker and profit margins are rising for the Magnificent Seven but

      @DeItaoneX14d ago1.5k▲view on X ↗
    2 more of the top 3 · 29 posts in this stretch
    • nixCraft@mastodon.social

      Despite massive investments and widespread hype around artificial intelligence, the technology has delivered zero financial payoff to corporate America outside of tech. Revenue per worker is rising for the Mag 7 but is flat for the S&P 493. And there are still no signs of AI boosting productivity growth https://www. apollo.com/wealth/insights-new…

      nixCraft@mastodon.socialMastodon14d ago220▲view on Mastodon ↗
    • I have worked in multiple companies where the internally developed software was central to the business success, yet it was handled in an extremely bad way, preventing it from using even a small percentage of its potential. The (good) developers were not the main problem there, but the management. The management did constantly override technical…

      FanmadeHacker News14d agoview on Hacker News ↗
    all of them →
  4. 3

    Apollo's Slok publishes 'No Signs of AI Payoff Outside the Tech Sector'

    Apollo Chief Economist Torsten Slok released a Daily Spark research note arguing AI has delivered zero financial payoff to corporate America outside of tech, with flat revenue per worker, flat margins, and no productivity gains for the S&P 493.

    “Despite massive investments and widespread hype around artificial intelligence, the technology has delivered zero financial payoff to corporate America outside of tech.”
    — Torsten Slok, Apollo Chief Economist
    1. first by Demokratis.co.id, 14d ago · also HN Best, HN Frontpage, PPC Land, Bloomberg

      4 more headlines
    2. first by Indian Express, 13d ago · also Seeking Alpha, Yahoo Finance, Futurism

      3 more headlines
    6 more claims →
    • Here's the data for US personal consumption expenditures which comprise 2/3rds of the GDP:U.S. PERSONAL CONSUMPTION EXPENDITURES (Q2 2026 BEA DATA)==============(In USD Billions)TOTAL PERSONAL CONSUMPTION EXPENDITURES $21,993.2 100.0% SERVICES $15,131.8 68.8% - Housing and Utilities $3,801.2 17.3% - Health Care $3,551.6 16.1% - Financial Services…

      charm137Hacker News14d agoview on Hacker News ↗
    2 more of the top 3 · 33 posts in this stretch
    • carnage4life@mas.to

      Apollo’s chief economist finds that there is still no measurable impact of AI adoption on corporate America outside of big tech. Revenue per employee and profit margins are rising for the Magnificent Seven but flat for the other 493 S&P 500 companies. The AI industry is making money selling AI, but its customers aren’t yet seeing any payoff…

      carnage4life@mas.toMastodon14d agoview on Mastodon ↗
    • I have mixed experience. AI has helped me investigate issues faster and easier. Connecting Splunk, Datadog, and other tools has been great. Anything else varies wildly. It's great to making sure the changes has no side effects. But writing Specs? Writing Jira tickets? Writing big code changes? It's awful. I hate reading AI generated specs. They…

      ryuzaki49r/technology14d agoview on r/technology ↗
    all of them →
  5. 1 day quiet
  6. 2

    Tech selloff deepens on AI capex worries before earnings

    Big Tech shares sold off as investors scrutinized AI spending plans, with Meta's roughly $825 billion decade-long spending plan unsettling markets even as Microsoft, Alphabet and Amazon were seen as better positioned.

    “Markets want evidence that AI investments are generating revenue.”
    — Bloomberg Markets newsletter
    1. first by Los Angeles Times, 14d ago · also Japan Times, Bloomberg

      1 more headline
    2. first by Seeking Alpha, 12d ago

  7. 1

    Economist flags AI industry's debt load worrying investors

    Ahead of the Apollo note, reporting highlighted that the AI sector's growing debts were making investors nervous, part of a building backdrop of market anxiety over AI spending.

    1. first by Bloomberg Markets, 17d ago · also Business Insider

      1 more headline

What people are saying 16 voices from 5 sites · best of 112 · verbatim

Still unanswered
  • Will Alphabet, Amazon and Microsoft earnings this week show evidence that AI spending is translating into revenue growth?
  • Is the 'S&P 493' framing itself distorted by the fact that excluding the Mag 7 makes the rest of the index look weaker than it otherwise would?